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PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 6:07 am 
 
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Soulzek wrote:
lord2800 wrote:
Soulzek wrote:
Im glad its a new team, after all D2 was a horrendous pile of fucking shit from a technical view.

Less dupes this time around thats for sure


You go design and build (from scratch, I might add, meaning no code that you didn't write yourself) a completely 100% secure client/server game. Go ahead, I'll wait.


compare the exploit in d2 to starcraft, wc3, or wow
clearly blizzard north wasn't that great


There's just as many exploits in starcraft as d2, there just different because the games different.

War3 obviously learned from what security holes there where in sc and d2 and improved.
WOW was p2p, so there was a huge drive to keep it bug/hack free, more so than the other games.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:28 am 
 
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I love the D2 style, Ben Boos. I'm sure I'll miss your touch in D3. :'(

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:54 pm 
 
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Soulzek wrote:
compare the exploit in d2 to starcraft, wc3, or wow
clearly blizzard north wasn't that great


Good software takes 10 years to develop.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:45 am 
 
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Sabotage wrote:
Did you do all the illustrations for your book? And, if you don't mind, what part of the art process were you involved in whilst creating Diablo2/3? Character design, weapons, armor, environment, doodads, a little of everything?

I'm working on illustration now in hopes of doing concept art in games is why I ask.


I encourage you, all the way. You have to just go for it hardcore.

My work on D2/D2X/D3: Oh man, it's a blur these days, but I did tons of little things. I started at B.N. working on cinematics, making a montage with a burning cathedral - then we consolidated the cinematics down at Blizz South. They had tons more experience at it, that was a relief.

After that, I put the first ground tiles together, creating the base tiles for Act 1, 2, 3, and eventually 5. I made ground, paths, grass, trees, bushes, rivers, rocks, desert, temples, big stone heads, docks, boats, jungle, swamp, tundra, cliffs, mesas, ice cliffs, ice caves, omg... I lose track. I also made lots of little things, like various barriers, coffins, altars, and stuff. I was often asked to add "grit" to indoor scenes, by painting blood and dirt and wear and tear. When art looked too clean, I was asked to "Boosify" it. :)

I also made the angel and demon UI, and most of the UI ornament and scrollwork... Lets see... the inventory screen, the quest log, stash, tons of icons and buttons... on and on. I'm pretty proud of the battlenet UI - especially the clickable gem ;) Also some box art and manual illustration (the Diablo BattleChest art). I painted some weapons, scrolls, potions, gems, doo-dads and lots of little crap too. I can hardly remember, but lots of little stuff all over the place.

For D3, i was utterly burned out on environment stuff, so i worked on prototype UI and lots of monster and weapon concept stuff. But I'm really not sure what will make it into the final game, given the technical and team changes. All in all, I played my humble little role, adding a certain look to the Diablo world. It was a team effort, and a huge challenge, because all the work was so limited in resolution and often had to tile together in little squares. Argh!

As for my book, I'm the author and illustrator. I sit here monk-like, and just do my thing to the sound of blaring music. :)

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:51 am 
 
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Benny, you must tell us: What was the purpose of the chatgem?

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:52 am 
 
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BenBoos wrote:
especially the clickable gem ;)


By the way, what does that do? Just kidding...

I'm going to sticky this topic just because you rocked D2.

edit: Damn you, Sytar.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:58 am 
 
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Sytar wrote:
Benny, you must tell us: What was the purpose of the chatgem?


Max Schaefer and I were sitting around kidding about it - that it looked like a button... so I made it clickable, as a joke to drive people crazy. I think a programmer added a little mischief to it. I forget what it does, or says, when you click it long enough, but something happens.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:06 am 
 
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Dark_Mage- wrote:
BenBoos wrote:
especially the clickable gem ;)


By the way, what does that do? Just kidding...

I'm going to sticky this topic just because you rocked D2.

edit: Damn you, Sytar.


Thanks! I had lots of talented help, for sure. It was a great time working on that crazy game. We were just a group of humble dudes, and it fell together in a strange way.

Try getting any 5 developers to get along under pressure, and anything can happen - let alone with dozens at work. It can be like herding cats! Not easy, so I consider that project to have been blessed in a wacky way, despite all its shortcomings. It could have gone wrong in so many ways.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:10 am 
 
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BenBoos wrote:
Sabotage wrote:
Did you do all the illustrations for your book? And, if you don't mind, what part of the art process were you involved in whilst creating Diablo2/3? Character design, weapons, armor, environment, doodads, a little of everything?

I'm working on illustration now in hopes of doing concept art in games is why I ask.


I encourage you, all the way. You have to just go for it hardcore.

My work on D2/D2X/D3: Oh man, it's a blur these days, but I did tons of little things. I started at B.N. working on cinematics, making a montage with a burning cathedral - then we consolidated the cinematics down at Blizz South. They had tons more experience at it, that was a relief.

After that, I put the first ground tiles together, creating the base tiles for Act 1, 2, 3, and eventually 5. I made ground, paths, grass, trees, bushes, rivers, rocks, desert, temples, big stone heads, docks, boats, jungle, swamp, tundra, cliffs, mesas, ice cliffs, ice caves, omg... I lose track. I also made lots of little things, like various barriers, coffins, altars, and stuff. I was often asked to add "grit" to indoor scenes, by painting blood and dirt and wear and tear. When art looked too clean, I was asked to "Boosify" it. :)

I also made the angel and demon UI, and most of the UI ornament and scrollwork... Lets see... the inventory screen, the quest log, stash, tons of icons and buttons... on and on. I'm pretty proud of the battlenet UI - especially the clickable gem ;) Also some box art and manual illustration (the Diablo BattleChest art). I painted some weapons, scrolls, potions, gems, doo-dads and lots of little crap too. I can hardly remember, but lots of little stuff all over the place.

For D3, i was utterly burned out on environment stuff, so i worked on prototype UI and lots of monster and weapon concept stuff. But I'm really not sure what will make it into the final game, given the technical and team changes. All in all, I played my humble little role, adding a certain look to the Diablo world. It was a team effort, and a huge challenge, because all the work was so limited in resolution and often had to tile together in little squares. Argh!

As for my book, I'm the author and illustrator. I sit here monk-like, and just do my thing to the sound of blaring music. :)


That's awesome. Sounds like a lot of grueling work mixed in with more interesting stuff but still, awesome, exactly what I want to get into. Although I'm concentrating on character design right now, working on turnarounds and the like, I want to start getting into environment either this semester or the next. Was it simpler to do art for an isometric 2d game like D2 than it is for a fully 3d (though still isometric) D3? Or any other regular 3d game you may have worked on? I would imagine D2 would have been (relatively) simple drawing it out and painting it into the game rather than what (again, I only speculate) 3d games require - doing full turnarounds of each object for the modeler (who may be you, that's another thing I gotta start learning.)

You mentioned the environment tiles, and I've seen examples of them on the D3 website. I've never seen those before so it's interesting to me, does one tile represent the style of an entire area? Are they thumbnails for expansive environments? I notice that the perspective the tiles are in doesn't really match the perspective of the game, at least not until they are finalized. Is that an artist choice for better visualization?

Sorry if I'm badgering you with questions, I'm rather interested in the processes :P

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:22 am 
 
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Oh this is cool.
Do you think Reziarfg will be in Diablo 3?

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:34 am 
 
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Keep at it!

Working in 2d was simpler in some ways, but maddening in others. Our tile system had a tiny grid of tiles, that had to blend with all other ground tiles of a matching set. Each tile was only a little larger than a barrel in the game. The stash chest would sit on several, I believe. So making a path of dirt run through grass took tons of pieces. Any features that added interest, also tended to show the tile seams or to show up as funky, repeating visual bother.

I had to invent my own way to make one tile blend with the next, and it took some messing around before I developed a reasonable system. sometimes we built a larger chunk of tiles together into a scene or set-piece. This gave the artist some more freedom. I think D3 probably tiles sizable chunks of land, much, much larger than our old tiles.

As for d2, when dealing with trees, or worse, cliffs or stairs, or temple entrances, it was a nightmare. The upshot was that it all got rendered out as a sprite- so you didn't have to worry about poly-count or texture memory. 3d is awesome and better, and has much improved tools for working with environments and stuff. but if the game lets you get up close to things - you have to think about your game world at every angle and make it tight. We only had to worry about one angle, and a fixed camera.

Now, the tools are getting truly great - you can paint textures right on the 3d model with ease, so it's not the nightmare it once was to texture something that was unwrapped into the must unintuitive mess. Zbrush is really cool for adding bumps and texture right onto the model, too. Its a good time to be an artist!

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 Post subject: Reziarfg
PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:38 am 
 
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Mr. Mojo Risin' wrote:
Oh this is cool.
Do you think Reziarfg will be in Diablo 3?


I have no idea! when I chat with my buddies still working on d3, we usually just talk about other things. I'm in for a big surprise when I play d3, I'm sure. God knows what those guys are up to...

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 Post subject: hey
PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:06 am 
 
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Sabotage,

I was thinking about all these questions, and it dawned on me that I'm three years out of the loop (having worked on the book that long). I should probably be asking YOU how things are done these days. haha.

I'm sure you are up to some crazy stuff. I forget what version Maya is up to, let's put it that way. :)

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 4:25 am 
 
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Wow - It is an honor to have an individual such as yourself post on these forums. You brought about a visual dynamic that captured the masses, and to this day I am still in love with the graphics of Diablo and Diablo 2. The past few years have been dreary on these boards, filled with spam and lame trolls. This post is the first to actually have some sort of significance since the glory days.

Thank you for joining our community and I hope you stay.

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 Post subject: thanks
PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 4:34 am 
 
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Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 3:51 am
Thank you! I was a totally quiet guy all those blizzard years. I never even signed any of my work -- so its nice to raise my head up and chat about stuff with people who played the games.

Btw, I did resort to some hacks once (maybe from here?), when my son lost his level 50 Barbarian (accidentally deleted). I was able to get him back up to speed in a hurry. }:p

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